Area same-sex couple denied Communion

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Posted: Wednesday, January 29, 2014 11:54 pm | Updated: 10:16 am, Fri Jan 31, 2014.

An area woman was denied Communion at her mother’s funeral last month after a priest new to her parish learned she was in a same-sex relationship.

Carol Parker and her partner of nearly 20 years, Josie Martin, live in the small town of Chula, Mo., and had been attending St. Columban Catholic Church in Chillicothe, Mo., for 12 years when Ms. Parker’s mother passed away on Dec. 26. The obituary listed Ms. Parker as a surviving daughter and also mentioned her partner.

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Welcome to the discussion.

69 comments:

  • socialfingered posted at 5:46 am on Thu, Jan 30, 2014.

    socialfingered Posts: 2091

    The thing I want to know is were they denied this part of their religion at other times? I have a hard time buying their complaint if this was the practice all along.

     
  • bandit_snowman posted at 10:57 am on Thu, Jan 30, 2014.

    bandit_snowman Posts: 17

    Amazing how this pastor says no to them as the Catholic church is loaded with pedophiles and closet homosexuals. What a hypocrite.

     
  • MIOCENE posted at 1:14 pm on Thu, Jan 30, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    The Catholic Church has historically been slow in accepting human rights. I realize this sounds odd, but advances in civil rights by the secular has always pre-dated Church morality.

    During the centuries after Christ; the Church gave us plenty of words on human kindness; -but little action.

    ie. How come the Vatican didn't give the world a "Bill of Rights" centuries before the American Revolution?
    How come Pope Pius IX lent moral support to the slave masters of the South during our Civil War?

    The Catholic Church is a dictatorship; which presently cloaks itself in a veil of morality, love and kindnesss because it must do so in order to survive in Democracy.

    Yet if conditions ever returned to those of the Middle Ages; the only resurrection we would see is that of the red hot poker and the breast ripper.

    Beware what lies behind the kind words and pleasant smiles of the Catholic Clergy.

     
  • Motherof5 posted at 9:39 pm on Thu, Jan 30, 2014.

    Motherof5 Posts: 2

    .

     
  • MelissaDouglas posted at 10:26 pm on Thu, Jan 30, 2014.

    MelissaDouglas Posts: 7

    socialfingered - it is not the church's (or the priest's) responsibility to fish sins out of their parish. If Fr Kneib did not know that Ms Parker (or anyone) was committing a sin, he then would have no objection to administer communion to her. It is our duty, as Catholics, to receive communion with a pure heart, having been forgiven of any sins during the sacrament of reconciliation (confession - and the point at which Ms Parker [or anyone] should confess any mortal sin of the flesh) and having observed the Eucharistic fast (nothing to pass the lips 1 hour prior to or after receiving the Eucharist). If Ms Parker (or anyone) chooses NOT to confess her sins, that is on her conscience UNLESS it becomes publicly apparent to the priest in which it then becomes his responsibility to step forth and offer to counsel her so that she returns to that state of grace - allowing her to again receive communion.

    I'm not going to get into whether or not all religions, denominations of Christianity, or spiritual practices believe that homosexuality is a sin. I will say that, as Catholics, that is what we believe. If Ms Parker had been properly educated in her faith, she wouldn't have been so shocked when Fr Kneib asked her not to receive Holy Communion. I also believe he very eloquently stated that "having a same-sex attraction is not sinful in and of itself ... it is only when a person moves from attraction to willfully acting upon it that the situation becomes a sinful matter.”

    I, personally, have several friends and family members who are attracted to others of the same sex. Some of them practice their faith thoroughly and devoutly - choosing abstinence. Some of them do not. But that is where I, as a human being, remove myself from the equation and live by the rule of "don't judge me because I sin differently that you." I choose to believe in my faith - that being that certain sins are sins - and trust me, I'm no stranger to the confessional.

    ...which is where I will now address your statements, bandit_snowman & MIOCENE, EVERY SINGLE HUMAN BEING on this planet is born a sinner. A priest, a pope, a minister, a clergymen, a nun - is no less a human being than an actress, a doctor, a school teacher, a drug dealer, etc... we are all born to sin. It is our free will that we will be held accountable for - and (I believe) we will ALL be held accountable for the sins we commit on earth.


    That being said, you don't HAVE to be a member of my church. Nobody is forcing a grown woman to sit in the pew on Sunday. All I want to stress is that if someone is going to believe in a faith, be educated on what that faith believes and hold yourself accountable to that faith's teachings... ALL of them. Not just the ones that are convenient for your lifestyle.

    And yes, Ms Parker, Pope Francis did say something along the lines of "Who am I to judge?" But I can guarantee you that he wouldn't give you communion either...

     
  • bandit_snowman posted at 11:08 pm on Thu, Jan 30, 2014.

    bandit_snowman Posts: 17

    No one is born a "sinner". Everyone is born of their free-will. Having a religion dictate what you can and cannot do is the most hypocritical thing imaginable. All religion as a whole is hypocrisy. The Catholic Church needs to look deep into their past and see what true corruption they have done to non-believers. Hiding rapists of children, homosexuality in their midst.

    ...and I would guarantee that Pope Francis would have given them communion as what I have seen from his actions as the Pope.

     
  • MelissaDouglas posted at 11:08 pm on Thu, Jan 30, 2014.

    MelissaDouglas Posts: 7

    socialfingered - it is not the church's (or the priest's) responsibility to fish sins out of their parish. If Fr Kneib did not know that Ms Parker (or anyone) was committing a sin, he then would have no objection to administer communion to her. It is our duty, as Catholics, to receive communion with a pure heart, having been forgiven of any sins during the sacrament of reconciliation (confession - and the point at which Ms Parker [or anyone] should confess any mortal sin of the flesh) and having observed the Eucharistic fast (nothing to pass the lips 1 hour prior to or after receiving the Eucharist). If Ms Parker (or anyone) chooses NOT to confess her sins, that is on her conscience UNLESS it becomes publicly apparent to the priest in which it then becomes his responsibility to step forth and offer to counsel her so that she returns to that state of grace - allowing her to again receive communion.

     
  • MIOCENE posted at 8:31 am on Fri, Jan 31, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    Ah; so here we have MELISSADOUGLAS; who claims to adhere to Catholic teaching on Homosexuality. How convenient for her.

    Let's see how MELISSA adheres to some of the OTHER teachings of her church.

    "Sell everything you have and give it to the poor" Matthew: (chap 19: #21);
    -and from The teachings of the 12 Apostles: 4:8. "thou shall make thy brother partake in all things, and shall not say that anything is thy own".

    From The “Epistle of BARNABAS”: Lightfoot translation: 19-8: (a father of the Catholic church which Pope John Paul II used to justify the church's anti abortion position)
    "The faithful must bring the homeless into thy house (#3), not possess private property, and give to everyone who asks" (#19).
    These teachings are also reflected in Matthew: 19-21 and Luke: 14-13.

    Acts of the Apostles, 2:44-45: we read: "All
    who believed were together and had all things in common; and they sold their possessions and goods and distributed them to all.

    So when is the last time we saw this CATHOLIC; MELISSA DOUGLAS inviting the homeless and the vagrants to live in her home;
    or to dine with her and her family?

    When is the last time MELISSA sold all her possessions and gave the money to the poor?

    You see: MELISSA DOUGLAS hides behind a veil of piety and morality; while picking and choosing WHICH words of god fit her lifestyle and convenience.

    Melissa isn't a Catholic Gay, so it is easy for her to quote the teachings of her church against something of which she is NOT!

    Here is another teaching of the Catholic Church; along with the above of which MILISSA should take notice:
    "Woe to you hypocrites"; Matthew 23

    The more I hear out of the mouths of Christians on social issues; the more convinced I am that helll is overpopulated with the righteous.

    MIOCENE

     
  • notsomuch posted at 11:02 am on Fri, Jan 31, 2014.

    notsomuch Posts: 11

    Just another reason why the idea of a human intercessor is way messed up. It's hypocritical at best to assume that the Catholic Church rituals are anything more than just that, not ordained or sanctified, just observed. Pedophiles are welcome to the priesthood but a gay couple cannot accept communion. Shaking my head!

     
  • notsomuch posted at 11:10 am on Fri, Jan 31, 2014.

    notsomuch Posts: 11

    Whoa, hold on there a minute Miocene...Catholics are NOT Christians. If you're going to bash a religion, at least know the perimeters of it FFS.

     
  • MelissaDouglas posted at 12:33 pm on Fri, Jan 31, 2014.

    MelissaDouglas Posts: 7

    I'm pretty sure you have no idea who I am and what I do. Don't point fingers like a child and accuse me of things you have NO idea of. However, you are not God...and I don't have to defend or justify my life and my choices to you. I will tell you that I was raised in a church that did not teach me the right way to practice my faith. It wasn't until I was married and switched churches that I fully understood enough to defend why I believe what I believe and the "correct way" of being a Catholic. Doesn't mean I'm not still learning or that I'm not a sinner just like anyone else. I'm not sitting on some high and mighty, bible thumping throne.

    And please don't pull lines from scripture out of context and try to use them again people. Catholics penned and assembled the new testament. I'm not ignorant to scripture OR Canon Law.

     
  • MIOCENE posted at 2:11 pm on Fri, Jan 31, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    "and I don't have to defend or justify my life and my choices to you"

    Yes you do. YOU came to the public forum with your religion. I want to know how you justify supporting church teaching condemning Gay marriage; while ignoring the teachings of Jesus on wealth and poverty.

    It's also interesting how when pushed into a corner with their own scripture, the faithful always claim "OUT OF CONTEXT". Yet the parish priest takes scripture out of context all the time.

    If he DIDN'T take it out of context; you Catholics would head for the door and the pews would be empty.

    You want the whole context? Read ALL of Matthew, and read The Epistle of Barnabas.

    The Church Father St. Tertullian (book1) Vol. 4, chap I describes women as "the devils gateway and the ONES responsible for the death of Christ. -that men should lord over women.-that women are the first deserters of the divine, and live in a condemned state."

    St. Thomas Aquinas refers to women as Embryonic Defects in his Summa Theologica: Quest 92.

    You think this Church really cares about you?
    If the Catholic Church ever regained the dictatorial and universal power that it had in the Middle Ages; you, as a woman wouldn't believe what was happening to you; even while it was happening.


     
  • MIOCENE posted at 2:19 pm on Fri, Jan 31, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    The only reason the Church is doing ANYTHING about child sex in the priesthood is because it got CAUGHT.

    According to the Ryan and Murphy Reports; priests were raping children in Ireland as far back as the 1930's. Sex with children has probably been going on in the Church for centuries.

    The interesting thing about it is that it was the SECULAR arm of society which called attention to it; -NOT the religious.

     
  • MelissaDouglas posted at 2:46 pm on Fri, Jan 31, 2014.

    MelissaDouglas Posts: 7

    YOU accused me of ignoring "the teachings of Jesus on wealth and poverty." Again, you don't know me or what I do. But ok, here goes: right now I have 10 people living in my home. Six adults and four children under 12. I have no responsibility to anyone but my husband and I. Yet when a family with their four children needed a home, we opened ours to them. A week later two more young people (whom we are close to) were without a home and we took them in as well. We are all working together to take care of each other. We go without so that the kids are provided for. We are no stranger to being poor, hungry, and tried. But God always provides. And we are blessed and grateful to Him.

    So before you run your mouth about things you think you know about someone: don't.

     
  • DouginSD posted at 9:28 pm on Fri, Jan 31, 2014.

    DouginSD Posts: 2

    SUPER!

    Join the ranks of other unrepentant sinners. Those who will not follow Christ and the dictates of the church should not expect to be afforded the privileges of Church membership.

    Duhhhhhhhhhhhh

     
  • DouginSD posted at 9:35 pm on Fri, Jan 31, 2014.

    DouginSD Posts: 2

    HA!

    Just read some other comments - notably those from the poor, lacking in a clue called "Miocene", who thought he/she denigrated the CC by claiming it is "historically slow in accepting human rights". Good gravy!

    Not that this will be other than shouting into a gale force wind, but so I do my duty:

    Sir (or madame or whatever): We are called NOT to conform to this world - and it's, or your, notion of 'right and wrong', but to be TRANSFORMED by the Holy Spirit and follow CHRIST! Were you a Christian you would count your burdens as blessings, your hardships as gifts, and you would not be focused on grasping as much as you can of money,. power, 'human rights', or other earthly idols in your gnarly claws but on submitting to the Lord and being eternally thankful for his Grace despite your utter wretchedness.

    But that is folly to you. Naturally. The blind will ALWAYS see Christ as "foolishness".

    Cheers!

     
  • B4Changes posted at 9:54 pm on Fri, Jan 31, 2014.

    B4Changes Posts: 3702

    I add my AMEN! to DouginSD's comment! The best comment of the day! It nails God's Truth and gives concrete basis as to why all believers rest in the assurance of God's Grace! Thank you for your comment!

    "Every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus is Lord!" Makes one wonder what MIOCENE will sputter in that moment????

     
  • Motherof5 posted at 12:19 am on Sat, Feb 1, 2014.

    Motherof5 Posts: 2

    If you have the courage to understand this situation read the tract which has received the NIHIL OBSTAT, "Who Can Receive Communion?" At Catholic Answers.
    http://www.catholic.com/tracts/who-can-receive-communion.

    By the way, there is a support group for men and women with homosexual inclinations, dedicated to attaining chastity, in accord with the magisterium's teaching on homosexuality. It is called "Courage." You can find it at:
    www.couragerc.net/


    I am disappointed that this carelessly researched article has given the Catholic bashers another forum to spread their hate. But that is what sells newspapers!


     
  • Munchkin posted at 9:35 am on Sat, Feb 1, 2014.

    Munchkin Posts: 4351

    I personally don't see what the fuss is ! Father Kneib has his personal beliefs and his conscious , as an American he has rights to his beliefs , so who is anyone , be they gay or straight to impose their beliefs on him ? It really is that simple....

     
  • socialfingered posted at 9:46 am on Sat, Feb 1, 2014.

    socialfingered Posts: 2091

    If you don't want a religion telling you what to do then don't practice that religion. It's pretty simple.

     
  • MIOCENE posted at 8:51 am on Sun, Feb 2, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    Wow! You sound like you might be a true follower of Jesus Christ after all. :-)

    I stand corrected.

     
  • MIOCENE posted at 8:58 am on Sun, Feb 2, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    Keep in mind that the "dictates of the church" have not been consistent over the centuries.

    For example, Pope Gregory XIII (1572-85) said it was not homicide to kill an embryo of less than forty days since it was not human; and this decision was made with full knowledge of Greek studies in Embryology.

    The teachings on abortion as "murder" waffled back and forth over the centuries until Pope Pius IX claimed that ALL abortion was murder. This LAST decision is the one the Church goes by today.

    The NEXT century? Who knows?

     
  • MIOCENE posted at 9:17 am on Sun, Feb 2, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    "historically slow in accepting human rights". Good gravy!

    It took the Catholic Church close to 400 years to to stop burning women as witches; and killing house cats because the animals were thought to be creatures of the devil.

    It took the Church almost 50 years to stop treating Ben Franklin's lightning rod as heresy; and it took the Catholic Church CENTURIES to finally outlaw slavery and torture.

    Yes; I would say that is slow.
    The secular world has always been one step ahead of the Church in the area of human rigthts; then the Chrurch moves up behind in the wake and assumes the credit.

    Other then that: And other then all the mumbo jumbo about heaven; Jesus didn't say anything that was not already said by Confucius centuries before.


     
  • MIOCENE posted at 9:40 am on Sun, Feb 2, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    "god's truth?" Let's take a look at the claim of god's truth:

    It would be interesting to see a Rabbi, Catholic Theologian and an Islamic Cleric all sitting at a panel on National TV; each trying to prove the truth of his OWN religion to the exclusion of the other two.

    What a THREE-RING-CIRCUS that would be as the perceived absolutes of each religion disintegrate into nothing but blind faith based upon superstition and myth; rooted in exaggeration, hallucination, self-delusion; and lies

    How ridiculous each would look because each religion is only valid within its own scripture.

    However, you will never SEE such a panel because even the CLERGY knows that his own faith is nothing but rubbish; and that religion is nothing but big and small business where said clergy makes a living keeping the desperate faithful snapping at the dangling carrot of eternal salvation.

    Religion is a mental disorder.
    Only a mental disorder could prevent the faithful from realizing that of the hundreds of poets, philosophers, writers and historians who lived during the time of Jesus; along with the correspondence of average citizens throughout the Empire; there is little no mention of Jesus the “miracle worker“; or for that matter of Jesus at all.

    Very odd for a man-god who supposedly strolled the countryside healing everything from leprosy to blindness.

     
  • popski posted at 6:52 pm on Sun, Feb 2, 2014.

    popski Posts: 1852

    Some rather hateful, intolerant, bigoted posts, MIOCENE....

     
  • MIOCENE posted at 9:39 pm on Sun, Feb 2, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    Well, if my comments WERE hateful then the editors would have deleted them, so there must be 'food for thought' in what I say.

    You see popski: You won't let yourself THINK about religion as a mental disorder because you are afraid of what you might find out.

    Eternal Salvation“ is the engine that drives Christianity. It is the LIMITING FACTOR; -and without the bribe of this “dangling carrot“, the whole concept of Christianity . would be abandoned because no one would care.

    Quite frankly: if Christ showed up today and announced that there was no afterlife, the churches would empty and you would abandon your god.

    Notice that the clergyman always brings the CANDY JAR to every sermon; the candy jar containing the gift of eternal salvation; without which; the priest would have no hold over his flock.

    You see: It's not GOD that the faithful love. It's what god can GIVE them which is the real focus.

    Think about this: (Matthew 19-21)
    Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, AND YOU WILL HAVE TREASURE IN HEAVEN. Then, come, follow me."

    What if Jesus had left out the TREASURE IN HEAVEN? Would anyone have followed him?

    Would Christianity have taken root?
    The bribe. The bribe and the punishment; without which the engine of Christianity would have stalled in the first century.

    Think about it popski. What really keeps you going back to church?


     
  • Fedele Cattolico posted at 11:13 am on Thu, Feb 6, 2014.

    Fedele Cattolico Posts: 1

    The internal beliefs and disciplines of a church are rarely newsworthy.
    The News Press doesn't report on the shunning practiced by the Amish or
    the LDS or the dietary restrictions of Orthodox Judaism. Why was this
    story news? For the same reason a similar situation in 2012 in Maryland
    was "news":

    http://www.faithstreet.com/onfaith/2012/07/09/priest-in-lesbian-communion-
    denial-saga-out-at-the-washington-archdiocese/10096

    A LBGT activist with access to the media uses the death of a parent to
    advance her agenda against a particular church. This gives the usual cast
    of anti-Catholics a forum in which to post:

    "the idea of a human intercessor is way messed up"

    "the clergyman always brings the CANDY JAR to every sermon"

    "it took the Catholic Church close to 400 years to to stop burning women
    as witches"

    Perhaps Ms. Wisdom can follow this "news" up by reporting on an assessment
    of the life and works of Martin Luther King by 12 men wearing white sheets
    and hoods?


     
  • MIOCENE posted at 4:45 pm on Thu, Feb 6, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    The press reports on the Catholic Church because Catholicism is the only major religion which grew to it's present strength by doing exactly the OPPOSITE of what it's supposed founder; (Jesus Christ); stood for.

    Read on:

    JESUS CHRIST was a Jewish religious dissident who had three main objectives:

    1. Elevating the poor through the redistribution of wealth.
    2. Spiritual equality between the peasants and the high priests.
    3. Separating Judaism from the entanglements of (Roman) Government

    You see: Any religion based exclusively upon the original teachings of Christ would not thrive in a Capitalist world; a world of money and power.

    That's why Christianity had to be MODIFIED over the centuries; from a religion of equality, love and peace; into one of control through fear and guilt.

    HERE is the present Catholic Church:
    1. The Church that Catholics belong to now became filthy rich on the backs of the peasants; the exact OPPOSITE of what Jesus intended.
    2. It formed a hierarchy of “high priests”; the higher one goes, the closer to god; the exact OPPOSITE of what Jesus intended
    3. It formed “holy alliances” with government; and today maintains a lobby of Bishops in Washington; trading the Roman Government with later governments.
    The exact OPPOSITE of what Jesus intended.

    The Catholic Church has actually become the Anti-Christ.

    So you see: Catholics have a Church; but they have no god. They just don't know it.

     
  • Carl posted at 3:42 pm on Fri, Feb 7, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    I really don't understand the complaint. Why would any decent person want to participate in a Catholic ritual in the first place?? This cult runs a worldwide pedophile ring and is responsible for some of the worst atrocities in all history. Gay men and lesbians should hold themselves to a higher standard.

     
  • OSW posted at 12:33 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    OSW Posts: 2

    1. Show a total lack of ignorance of anything related to Catholicism and therefore spew hatred towards something in which they have no understanding.

    2. Make rash judgments of people regarding a situation they know nothing about.

    Its ironic, how the very people condemning the actions of a priest, in condemning him, do the very same thing they accuse him of doing.

    John 8:11-12...And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

    John 6:53 ...So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you.

    1 Corinthians ....Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty concerning the body and blood of the Lord. Let a person examine himself, then, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup. For anyone who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment on himself.

    It looks to me, based upon the words of Jesus, like there is one person regarding this issue acting out in true love for another person. Too bad the minions of this world, many of them posting on this site, want to crucify him for his love.


     
  • OSW posted at 12:37 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    OSW Posts: 2

    Good to see someone is actually looking at history here, too bad they aren't looking at it in context. I found this information regarding your comment on Catholic Answers. There is a basic misunderstanding of what the popes have cited with regard to your comment about Pope Gregory XIII. They, including Pope Gregory XIII, were not ruling on the rightness or wrongness of abortion, but making pastoral decisions regarding when abortion could be done without endangering a living soul. Another words based on the science of the time determining when a fetus came to be a human.

    Early in the Church most people believed that ensoulment didn't take place until "quickening," which the doctors of the day decided was at 40 days from conception. They didn't know anything about how conception happened or anything about genetics. You will recall that when Mary visited Elizabeth, when Elizabeth was 3 months pregnant, that her baby "leapt" in her womb. Apparently, this was the first evidence Elizabeth had that she was carrying a living child--one with a soul.

    As medicine advanced later popes made revised pastoral decisions regarding when abortions could be performed without endangering a living soul, including both the mother and child in the womb. Now days we know that the instant the sperm and egg join a unique individual has been created, the Church knows this because science says it’s so. We still don't know if the zygote has a soul at this point in the process of development, but that is precisely why in these modern times it has been decided that abortion cannot be performed. The reasoning’s is that since we cannot know the exact instant in which the fertilized egg has a soul, abortion cannot be done lest it mean killing a living soul.

    So, abortion has always been seen as an evil, but now the Church has come to see that it is an intrinsic evil since at any point in the development of a fetus it may destroy a living soul.

     
  • Chuck Ruthenberg posted at 4:18 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    Chuck Ruthenberg Posts: 6

    The press reports on the internal affairs and doctrines of the Catholic Church because Catholic bashing is one of the few acceptable biases left for the media now that burning crosses on lawns and keeping women in their place is not politically correct.

    What legitimate newsworthy purpose is served by an article that leads to a comment like "Catholics have a Church; but they have no god"?

     
  • Chuck Ruthenberg posted at 4:51 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    Chuck Ruthenberg Posts: 6

    Walk up to the next Catholic you run into and tell him he belongs to a cult running a pedophile ring. Make sure he's bigger than you and younger than you.

    Other than the fact that the incidence of child abuse peaked twenty years ago, that the bulk of the cases involved adolescents and not prepubescents, and that at its peak the incidence of abuse was lower than among public school teachers, Protestant ministers, or several other professions, you seem to have a firm grasp of who you hate.

    Every time an article like this is palmed off as "news", the anti-Catholics scurry about the comments section like cockroaches when the light is turned on.

     
  • bandit_snowman posted at 4:59 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    bandit_snowman Posts: 17

    Catholicism is nothing but a money grabbing cult that preys on the weak minded. This goes for all monotheistic religions. They should be taxed like any other entity as well. Tired of idiots trying to protect pedophiles behing the pulpit.

     
  • Chuck Ruthenberg posted at 6:17 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    Chuck Ruthenberg Posts: 6

    One of the more wonderful things about being a bigot is that you never have to use your brain.

     
  • bandit_snowman posted at 6:34 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    bandit_snowman Posts: 17

    Defend the pedophilia that's rampant in "your" faith then. Do you condone it or complicit with the actions?

     
  • bandit_snowman posted at 6:35 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    bandit_snowman Posts: 17

    All you've posted is ad hominem.

     
  • B4Changes posted at 7:43 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    B4Changes Posts: 3702

    The gospel according to MIOCENE....maybe a new religion? Ha!

     
  • Carl posted at 10:09 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    Chuck, I have NO problem telling Catholics that they belong to a cult, nor am I quiet when it comes to the thousands of cases of child abuse that bishops have covered up --- and continue to cover up even today. This vile cult has a history going back many centuries that includes child abuse, torture, burnings, genocide, sexism, homophobia, Crusades, war, violence, ignorance, and superstition. The time that the Catholic church ruled the Western world is what we now call the Dark Ages. Shame on you for supporting such a cult.

     
  • Carl posted at 10:11 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    Try as you will, there is NO excuse for the crimes committed by the Catholic church.

     
  • Carl posted at 10:14 pm on Sat, Feb 8, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    I am amazed that people would post remarks in support of the Catholics, or that they would try to excuse the abuse crimes against children. What kind of people are members of this strange sect???

     
  • Chuck Ruthenberg posted at 9:02 am on Sun, Feb 9, 2014.

    Chuck Ruthenberg Posts: 6

    The article was about women violating their church's teachings about sexuality and the logical consequences of that, not abuse crimes against children.

     
  • Chuck Ruthenberg posted at 9:03 am on Sun, Feb 9, 2014.

    Chuck Ruthenberg Posts: 6

    As a matter of fact, pedophilia is not "rampant in 'our' faith". Is bigotry rampant in yours?

     
  • Chuck Ruthenberg posted at 9:05 am on Sun, Feb 9, 2014.

    Chuck Ruthenberg Posts: 6

    And I have no problem at all telling a religious bigot to go fly a kite, buy a history book, and get with reality. During the Dark Ages the Church preserved the scientific and literary works that formed the foundation for the Renaissance.

     
  • bandit_snowman posted at 9:57 am on Sun, Feb 9, 2014.

    bandit_snowman Posts: 17

    It's the hypoc

     
  • bandit_snowman posted at 1:49 pm on Sun, Feb 9, 2014.

    bandit_snowman Posts: 17

    It's the hypocrisy that prevails in your faith. Of course you don't see it as you're a blind follower.

     
  • bandit_snowman posted at 1:52 pm on Sun, Feb 9, 2014.

    bandit_snowman Posts: 17

    And no, I don't follow any religion. I am an individual, not a sheep. But keep playing the bigot card because that's all you have as a defense.

     
  • Carl posted at 12:33 pm on Mon, Feb 10, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    You are very mistaken, Chuck. That is the lie that the Catholic church has told for a long time, but we know that much of the ancient writings would have been lost forever, if Islam had not preserved them. The bishops have lied to you, and you are gullible enough to believe their lies. This vile Catholic cult is responsible for the Inquisition, Crusades, torture, burnings, genocide of the Cathars and Waldenses, and a host of other atrocities. Get your head out of the sand.

     
  • Carl posted at 12:35 pm on Mon, Feb 10, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    But you could use your brain, Church, if you would just give it a try.

     
  • Carl posted at 12:36 pm on Mon, Feb 10, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    Chuck, THOUSANDS of cases = "rampant."

     
  • Carl posted at 12:39 pm on Mon, Feb 10, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    The root of support for this pedophile ring lies in the attitude of Catholics like Chuck who refuse to acknowledge that the Catholic cult has a serious problem that the bishops need to address rather than conceal. As long as Catholics will continue to support these crimes with their money and their rhetoric, we can't expect much change. It's an atrocity.

     
  • Carl posted at 12:44 pm on Mon, Feb 10, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    Chuck, exposing a criminal organization and speaking in defense of justice is not bigotry, else every court room in the country could be charged with bigotry. More and more priests are being sentenced to prison, but we need to continue to speak out, for when we didn't speak out, the crimes continued, and the vile cult continued its bad behavior with impunity. You can go on calling decent people bigots as much as you want, but that won't change the FACTS. All you have is name-calling, and that means that you really have nothing of substance to contribute.

     
  • Hart posted at 12:18 am on Tue, Feb 11, 2014.

    Hart Posts: 5

    Carl, your odds of getting molested in a public school are and were much higher than in a Catholic parish. The only serious problem here is that a news outlet chose to be a transmission belt for disgruntled ex-Catholics and that it lets this anti-Catholic tripe by a loud anti-Catholic clique keep getting posted.

     
  • bandit_snowman posted at 7:01 am on Tue, Feb 11, 2014.

    bandit_snowman Posts: 17

    @Hart, could you please source a link stating that there's more molestation in public schools than Catholic parishes? You and other followers are so ingrained in your faith that you can't see the forest through the trees.

     
  • Hart posted at 10:43 am on Tue, Feb 11, 2014.

    Hart Posts: 5

    http://www.themediareport.com/fast-facts/

    "Notwithstanding the media hysteria over sex abuse in the Catholic Church, priests abuse at a rate far lower than that of other males. While even one case of abuse is too many, approximately only 4% of all active priests between 1950 and 2002 were even accused of abuse – a rate far lower than that of other males in the general population."

    The "crisis" is primarily a media creation like the article on which we are commenting. It is like rotting meat to flies, all the anti-Catholics show up. Some of the anti-Catholics work in the media.

    There was nothing newsworthy about a Catholic priest in a Catholic parish following his Church's teachings. If you don't like, don't become a Catholic.

     
  • Hart posted at 10:45 am on Tue, Feb 11, 2014.

    Hart Posts: 5

    If it was a criminal organization, there'd be a RICO prosecution.

    If you rely for your information on Chick publications and the yellow press, you will continue to look silly.


     
  • Carl posted at 10:57 am on Tue, Feb 11, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    Yes, because it is men who are committing these crimes! For goodness sake, THINK!

     
  • Carl posted at 10:58 am on Tue, Feb 11, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    I thought you might want to change the subject, Chuck.

     
  • Carl posted at 11:05 am on Tue, Feb 11, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    Hart, I think you missed the point. Pedophilia is a crime for which the various priests are responsible. However, the cover up of these crimes goes to the highest levels of the Catholic church. For that, the organization itself is responsible. That is the crime of the Catholic church, not the individual cases of pedophilia. Any organization that responsible for such crimes should be closed down and the criminals at the head of that organization should be in jail. Can you give us even one example where any board of education over public schools has covered up such crimes or collected donations to support such criminals? I didn't think so.

     
  • Carl posted at 11:09 am on Tue, Feb 11, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    It's not quite that simple, Hart. The solution to an organizational crime is prosecution of the crime, not telling folks that they don't have to join the crime ring if they don't like the crime. Surely you see how silly you sound! Well, maybe not.

     
  • Carl posted at 11:21 am on Tue, Feb 11, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    Surely, the Catholic church is the last organization that should try to take some self-righteous high ground in such matters. This cult is getting by with internal crimes by withholding evidence, moving criminals from one region to another, or one country to another, and intimidating victims and their families. This vile cult has escaped prosecution only because of their great wealth. What other club would be allowed to escape prosecution for such despicable crimes?? The people of the United States should be ashamed to allow this vile cult to operate schools where children continue to be at risk of molestation. Those of us who have worked long and hard to make this vile cult responsible for its crimes are only now seeing the fruits of our efforts after thirty years of non-relentless dedication. Finally this cult is being exposed for exactly what it is.

     
  • Carl posted at 1:42 pm on Tue, Feb 11, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    Or perhaps it's just because the Catholic church is an evil vile cult that needs to be exposed. Is that a possibility, Chuck??

     
  • Hart posted at 5:27 am on Wed, Feb 12, 2014.

    Hart Posts: 5

    Of course it's that simple. Until there's a conviction, there is presumption of innocence.

    Adolph Hitler advocated telling a big lie, and telling it over and over.

    As YOU do this, you're doing the work of the media anti-Catholics and other manipulators of the weak-minded like yourself.

     
  • Hart posted at 5:29 am on Wed, Feb 12, 2014.

    Hart Posts: 5

    The statement "more and more priests are being sentenced to prison" is unsupported claptrap.

     
  • Carl posted at 1:28 pm on Wed, Feb 12, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    What kind of threat do you suggest the Catholics might pose, Chuck? Do you believe they might resort to physical violence?

     
  • Carl posted at 1:30 pm on Wed, Feb 12, 2014.

    Carl Posts: 17

    Speaking out against a worldwide pedophile ring is not bigotry, Chuck!

     
  • MIOCENE posted at 2:34 pm on Wed, Feb 12, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    Yiou see: Your response is what is known as VERBAL GYMNASTICS; in order to cover up the fact that regardless of the guidance of the Holy SPIRIT; the church waffled back and forth for centuries as to the status of the embyro.

    YES the church said abortion was evil; but except for Pope Sixtus (ie); did not arrive at the present stance of abortion as MURDER until 1869 ce.


    THIS is the biggest cop-out of them all:
    "Pope Gregory XIII, were not ruling on the rightness or wrongness of abortion, but making pastoral decisions regarding when abortion could be done without endangering a living soul. Another words based on the science of the time determining when a fetus came to be a human."

    Here you apply TWO DIFFERENT RULES OF THE GAME to two different popes. Pope Pius IX WAS ruling on the rightness or wrongness of abortion but Pope Gregory was NOT. You cannot change the rules to fit the pope you agree with.

    Also as I stated: Early popes had full knowlege of Greek studies in Embryology; diagrams and all. The stages of fetal development didn't look any different THEN then they do now.

     
  • MIOCENE posted at 2:39 pm on Wed, Feb 12, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    "Catholics have a Church but no god."
    This is why: You probably didn't read it the first time.

    JESUS CHRIST was a Jewish religious dissident who had three main objectives to reform his religion:

    1. Elevating the poor through the redistribution of wealth.
    2. Spiritual equality between the peasants and the high priests.
    3. Separating Judaism from the entanglements of (Roman) Government


    Here is the PRESENT Catholic Church:
    1. The Church that Catholics belong to now became filthy rich on the backs of the peasants; the exact OPPOSITE of what Jesus intended.
    2. It formed a hierarchy of “high priests”; the higher one goes, the closer to god; the exact OPPOSITE of what Jesus intended
    3. It formed “holy alliances” with government; and today maintains a lobby of Bishops in Washington; trading the Roman Government with later governments.
    All the exact OPPOSITE of what Jesus intended.

    The Catholic Church has actually become the Anti-Christ.

    And that's why Catholics have a CHURCH; -but no god.


     
  • MIOCENE posted at 3:04 pm on Wed, Feb 12, 2014.

    MIOCENE Posts: 518

    Let’s take an OBJECTIVE look at Christ as a god.

    In December there was a Menorah and a Nativity scene side by side.

    The Nativity Scene says that Jesus was the savior; and the Menorah says (or represents) NO; he WASN'T the savior; that the so-called divine Jesus was a hoax; and that the savior is yet to come.

    These are both ABSOLUTES to Jews and Christians; meaning that the Jews KNOW they are right, and the Christians also know THEY are right; as EACH can provide proof of validity from scripture.

    So within the framework of these two absolutes; Christianity is a absolute POSITIVE with respect to the messianic Jesus; and Judaism is an absolute NEGATIVE with respect to this same Jesus.
    A positive and a negative cancel each other out to a net value of ZERO.

    So you see:
    Regardless of the rich history of both religions; the statues, paintings, all the theologians past and present, the magnificent cathedrals and temples; the monotonous words of thousands of clergy, the holy cities and the holy wall;
    -we find that the combined Messianic absolutes of Christianity and Judaism cancel each other out to a net value of ZERO.

    It all adds up to NOTHING, at least nothing more then was known and practiced by the Iroquois Indians; thousands of years before Moses took his first breath.

    Therefore: The validity of any conclusion that the Catholic Church; or ANY church for that matter makes; cannot be valid from the position of GOD; because NO Church; be it Islam, Jewish or Christian has yet proven that IT; to the exclusion of all the others; is the true religion.

    However; if one wants to join the club; then one had better live by the rules.
    If the priest was acting under the direction of the Pope; then the priest was right at this particular moment in time.

     

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